View Full Version : 3251 History repeats itself

05-02-2014, 05:21 PM
My name is Andrew Aloisi, when I was in college in the late 50's the Mark ll was introduced and I fell in love with it,but considered it an impossible dream. Its sticker price of $10,000 was more than twice the average household salary at the time. However, in 1972 I was able to purchase a white unrestored Mark for $2,500, it was in pretty bad shape, brakes could barely stop the car and water and snow would blow into the interior. I managed to drive it from Boston to Narragansett Restorations in Rhode Island to see if they could restore it, but they said the frame was too rusty to be considered a good candidate for restoration.They agreed to try to sell it for me which they did for $2000. I didn't consider that a loss because I had had more than $500 worth of enjoyment driving the car short distances.
I recently read of the death of a Ford family member who was one of the first owners of a Mark ll. That article rekindled my passion for the car and I joined this forum in the hopes of finding a nice black restoration. I also reached out to the person who bought the car 40 years ago. He was a welder and was able to restore the car after working on it himself for many years. He loved the car and sold it for $17,000. The vin is c56h2351. I would love to find one while I am still able to drive.

Mark II Seeker
05-02-2014, 05:29 PM
Welcome to the Forum. that's a great story about your Mark having been saved and restored.

It took me well over three years to find a nice black Mark II. There seem to be a number of black cars that could use some love but few that were properly restored and worth anywhere near the asking price. I was fortunate to find a very nice original.

05-03-2014, 02:40 AM
Welcome. Black Marks really look regal. I know, I have one. :D Hope you find a black Mark with your name on it soon.

Pat Marshall
05-03-2014, 10:13 AM

Welcome to the Forum! We have some questions about the VIN of your car. C56H2351 was not a Mark II VIN. The first three digits (C56) of a Mark II VIN were standard for all Mark IIs. The fourth digit was the month that the car was produced. "H" indicates cars that were manufactured in June 1956. The remaining three or four digits indicated the cars sequential number.

The problem is that the number sequence of cars manufactured in June 1956 was C56H3205-C56H3259. Cars Manufactured in January 1956 had VINS from C56C2236-C56C2620.

I checked the obvious, C56C2351. This car was a white car sold new in Chicago, IL and it remained in Illinois until 1992, then it went to Wisconsin where it still is.

So, I then thought there might have been a transposition and checked C56H3251. 3251 was also a white car with a Green and White Interior which was sold new on June 28, 1956 to Holmes Motors, Inc., Waltham, Massachusetts. Most recently, 2005, it was reported as being in West Virginia.

Of great interest is a Post-It note attached to the invoice by Mark II guru Lowell Domholdt which states: "LCOC Card for C56H2351 (No such car!). This implies that card is really for C56H3251 14-1M6E"

I talked to Lowell about this and he said the "LCOC Card" was the card that LCOC owners filled out then they joined or renewed their membership. Apparently Graham T. Jones reported owner (1976-1978) of C56H3251 transposed his car VIN as C56H2351. Subsequently LCOC Secretary June Davis recorded this as "C2351" in the directory. Lowell caught that error about 15 years later and made the above note on the original invoice.

I have a few questions:
1. Do you know if your car was originally black?
2. Was the interior green & white?
3. Was it air conditioned?
4. Did it have front bumper guards?
5. Is the name Graham T. Jones familiar to you?
6. Do you know the name of any owners before or after you?

The one thing is that it seems to be quite a coincidence that both you and prior owner Jones reported owning C56H2351. Do you have an old title or other documentation that supports the C56H2351 VIN? Maybe it was something as simple as a DMV title error?

With a little more information, I believe we will be able to determine which car you owned.

Here are the links to our histories for 2351 and 3251



Pat Marshall

09-16-2014, 03:17 PM
Thank you, Brian, Howard and Pat, forgive the late response, I am still trying to learn how to navigate the exchange of correspondence in the Forum. I am in the process of purchasing and further restoring the "Jack Warner" black Mark ll.
Pat, The title to my first Mark bears the VIN c56h2351. I don't think the car was originally black and I do not recall the interior color, but I do not think it was green. I sold it to Graham T. Jones, then of West Hartford CT. I was able to track him down on the internet and called him and he related what he did with the car. He would know better if the car had AC, I bought it in the winter. Will keep you posted on the "new" car. Let me know if you want me to send any documentation (and how to send it)

Pat Marshall
09-16-2014, 10:26 PM
Andrew, maybe you can help me straighten out the ownership records for 3251.

Here are the various things that we have.

* You stated that you purchased the car in 1972

* You stated that you sold the car to Graham T. Jones, no year given.

* LCOC Records show that in 1976-1978 Graham Jones owned the car. We have no other dates for Jones.

* You stated that (Graham T. Jones) ...was a welder and was able to restore the car after working on it himself for many years.

* You also said that you called Jones ...and he related what he did with the car....

So I am hoping that you can help fine-tune 3251's ownership history.

We show:
1957-?? No History Found
1972-1976 Andrew Aliosi, Boston, MA
1976-78 Graham Jones CT
1979-?? No History Found
??-2005 Curtis Acton WV
2006-Present No History Found

Please let us know what to change.

09-17-2014, 11:51 AM
Pat, I bought the car on Dec.26th, 1973 and sold it to Jones on May 7th 1976. I will send you his telephone number in a private message in case you want to speak with him directly, he is 79 years old and, off course, enjoys talking about the Mark he saved from the scrap heap.

Pat Marshall
10-13-2014, 12:13 AM
Andrew thank you for the information on 3251. I'm running on slow-time, but I've finally updated the history of your old car.

Here is the link to 3251's updated history.